Feeding separate Stereo and AV preamps into ATC AmpPacks.

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Re: Feeding separate Stereo and AV preamps into ATC AmpPacks.

Postby studioman » Wed Nov 09, 2016 8:55 am

MattSPL wrote:I'm not sure to be honest. I guess that if there is a relay or switch in the path at the pre amp that is off, then the signal will only go this far, meaning the pre that is in use will only see the extra impedance of the cable and possibly a little of the other pre.

I did once run 2 sets of xlr's off my Dac/pre(wired into one xlr at the Dac end) so I could feed the ATC's and a sub with the same balanced signal. This worked just fine.


Thanks, Matt. That's also food for thought. Going to try a pair of Combiners by Stageline and see if they are ANY good at all. If not I might get in touch with EA Soweter (transformers) and ask their advice. Otherwise I'll just make a switch box I guess.

Cheers mate,

David
They say if you can remember the 60's, you weren't really there. Now somehow I have reached 62...oh shit, it's 63 now....How and when did THAT happen?....there's a lesson there somewhere if only I could figure it out...

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Re: Feeding separate Stereo and AV preamps into ATC AmpPacks.

Postby MattSPL » Wed Nov 09, 2016 4:23 pm

Hi David,

Hopefully those stageline combiners work out.

Cheers
Matt
Sony BDP-S790 > Matrix Quattro Dac > Digidesign RM2's with SB Acoustics drivers > DIY Dayton Audio UM18-22 Sub

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Re: Feeding separate Stereo and AV preamps into ATC AmpPacks.

Postby Brad Lunde » Sun Nov 20, 2016 7:19 pm

MattSPL wrote:Hi David,

Hopefully those stageline combiners work out.

Cheers
Matt


They sound awful. All the methods for doing this change the sound drastically.
Brad
Brad Lunde
Lone Mountain Audio, part of TransAudio Group
ATC Importers USA

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Re: Feeding separate Stereo and AV preamps into ATC AmpPacks.

Postby studioman » Sun Nov 20, 2016 10:29 pm

I trust your judgement Brad.

OK, I think I'm going to try gold contact relays.

I can set two separate ones up, one for each channel, with 3 2-way contacts to allow through the balanced signal direct from the stereo preamp when the solenoid is NOT actuated.

If I then actuate the solenoid to switch those contacts over to the output from the AV preamp, it will connect the latter through to my ATC Active speakers.

Any signal loss will be minimised this way.

I hope.
They say if you can remember the 60's, you weren't really there. Now somehow I have reached 62...oh shit, it's 63 now....How and when did THAT happen?....there's a lesson there somewhere if only I could figure it out...

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Re: Feeding separate Stereo and AV preamps into ATC AmpPacks.

Postby Brad Lunde » Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:36 am

studioman wrote:I trust your judgement Brad.

OK, I think I'm going to try gold contact relays.

I can set two separate ones up, one for each channel, with 3 2-way contacts to allow through the balanced signal direct from the stereo preamp when the solenoid is NOT actuated.

If I then actuate the solenoid to switch those contacts over to the output from the AV preamp, it will connect the latter through to my ATC Active speakers.

Any signal loss will be minimised this way.

I hope.


I think this is the best idea. Good luck!
Brad
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Re: Feeding separate Stereo and AV preamps into ATC AmpPacks.

Postby studioman » Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:22 pm

Thanks, Brad.

I know that a lot of companies sell RCA switch boxes, and there are a few who sell XLR switch boxes at high prices. A couple of companies sell auto (signal-sensing) switch boxes for RCS Line Level and even for Speaker Level signals. But NO-ONE, as far as I can see, sells XLR input switching boxes which are automatic, without compromising signal integrity.

So....

My plan is this....I think.....(it's a bit old-school but it does use a bit of new ECO technology!!!!

I am perfectly capable of turning on the active speakers myself. I can turn on the stereo system...turntable, CD, DAC etc., myself.

If I buy a master/slave mains power extension just for the AV system.... NOT for the stereo.....and plug the AV system (plasma or AV amp) into the extension as the MASTER....then when I turn the AV system on with my remote, it will trigger power to the slave sockets on the so-called ECO extension. I can use this knowledge to good effect, I think.

Now...my relays are 12v DC. So, if I wire up a Tricks box containing the 2 gold multipole relays, 2 XLR inputs, and 1 XLR output.... and I buy a 12v DC power supply (wall wart), I can set it up so that when there is NO POWER to the relays, they connect XLR Input 1 to XLR output directly.
This will mean that the default scenario is Stereo Preamp through XLR cable to RELAY box to ATC Amp Pack. One setup per channel of course.

When the Plasma screen is turned on however, the AV system triggers the SLAVE power sockets, thereby turning on the 12v Wall wart. This in turn will send power to the Relays causing them to switch to the other XLR socket, thereby over-riding the stereo connection to the speakers.

Because everything is working at LINE LEVEL, and the preamp outputs never meet (they are 100% isolated from each other), it will be 100% safe and foolproof.

Image

Why is nobody selling an arrangement like this. It's a simple relay switch box coupled with a readily available ECO power saving extension. Or would it be just for a very few enthusiasts like myself and therefore commercially not worth looking into? What am I not seeing?
They say if you can remember the 60's, you weren't really there. Now somehow I have reached 62...oh shit, it's 63 now....How and when did THAT happen?....there's a lesson there somewhere if only I could figure it out...

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Re: Feeding separate Stereo and AV preamps into ATC AmpPacks.

Postby Brad Lunde » Mon Nov 28, 2016 5:04 pm

There is one other idea, Ben and I at the factory talked about this idea and its a good one for people like us.
Use a Receiver/integrated (the device for surround decoding) as the main input panel for multichannel sources. For stereo music, use your better sounding 2 channel preamp/amp or integrated. Hook up the multichannel to everything except the FL/FR. Hook up the preamp amp to the FL/FR and use this as the inut panel for all your better 2 channel sources (turntable, DAC, etc). Then, take the FL/FR line outputs of the multichannel receiver and hook them to a spare aux input of the preamp/amp. Set up and calibrate the Surround system to find unity gain on the preamp/amp (so that the FR/FL are the same level as they would be if no preamp/amp was used). SO, when you want multichannel, turn everything on, find that unity setting on the preamp amp. When you want 2 ch music only, use the preamp/amp.

Brad
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Re: Feeding separate Stereo and AV preamps into ATC AmpPacks.

Postby studioman » Mon Nov 28, 2016 10:12 pm

Thanks, Brad. That IS food for thought. It's a very good idea.
My gut feeling, however, is that as it's not just for me to use, it has to be easy for anyone else in the house to use the AV setup. And I think that, for me, the relay idea with auto switching might be the better choice.

Also, I know that both my Naim AV2 AV preamp and my stereo preamp have a unity gain pass through, but I don't think this works when the power to them is off....I'll have to find out....
But it IS yet another option...Cheers!
They say if you can remember the 60's, you weren't really there. Now somehow I have reached 62...oh shit, it's 63 now....How and when did THAT happen?....there's a lesson there somewhere if only I could figure it out...

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